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    Welcome to Carnivore Talk! An online community of people who have discovered the benefits of an animal-based ketogenic diet with the goal of losing weight, optimizing their health, and supporting and encouraging one another. We warmly welcome you! [Read More]

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This topic was split off from the topic "It's tallow making time"

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5 minutes ago, Geezy said:

 


At room temperature it will last 12 months.
It will last up to 18 months in the fridge and I’ve heard as long as 2 years.
It will last over 2 years in the freezer with no problems.

I’m freezing 6 jars. 3 jars will go in the fridge and one jar will stay out on the counter at room temp for cooking. It’s much easier to use when it’s soft.
I also don’t refrigerate the butter that I’m using, only if I’m storing it. I use salted butter and it keeps just fine at room temp.


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Is there No problem using butter on carnivore diet?

What about dairy products in general?

Its been 50 days since I started and I feel amazing but I would love to add some fruit and vegs, and dairy if possible 

@Bob @Geezy

 

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Dairy is perfectly fine on carnivore provided you are lactose tolerant, which I am. Dairy is an animal product. Just make sure that it’s not low fat because low fat is nothing but sugar.
For those that are lactose intolerant , many can still enjoy butter because it’s almost all fat and fat is good.
Cheese and cream is also good.

Fruits and vegetables are not carnivore and there is no place for them in our diet. Fruits are nothing but fructose and have little nutritional value and vegetables are even worse with their toxins and anti-nutrients. What little bit of nutrition they have is not bio available to us so I don’t see the point in eating them. That goes for seeds and seed oils as well.

If you want to quit carnivore and bring fruits and vegetables back into your diet then go ahead. It’s your choice and if they don’t affect you in any way then fine, enjoy them.
I just know that I can’t tolerate them and have no desire to reverse all of the healing I’ve experienced.


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56 minutes ago, Matan1262 said:

Is there No problem using butter on carnivore diet?

Butter is an animal product, so enjoy all the butter you want 🙂

56 minutes ago, Matan1262 said:

What about dairy products in general?

This depends on your goals. Dairy is an animal product, so yes you could enjoy it. However, if losing weight or being in a ketogenic state most of the time is your goal, then you will want to watch your carb count. You can generally stay in ketosis most of the day if you keep your carb count lower than 20g. Milk has 8g of carbs per cup, which comes from lactose, which is a milk-sugar.

Check out this article on The Various Types of Carnivore Diets. Technically you would be switching from a Standard Carnivore Diet to an Any Animal-products Carnivore Diet.

58 minutes ago, Matan1262 said:

Its been 50 days since I started and I feel amazing but I would love to add some fruit and vegs, and dairy if possible 

It might be possible. It all depends on your and your personal physiology and your personal health goals. Technically, you would be switching to an Animal-based "Carnivore" Diet or a Carnivorish/Ketovore Diet.

If you are trying to lose weight and live a healthy life, all of these might work for you. If you are trying to heal certain maladies, then the stricter you are to true carnivore, the better.

Many people choose Standard Carnivore or Lion Diet as an elimination diet for 60, 90, or 180 days and then they will test adding back certain foods to see how their body reacts. This is a powerful tool for you personally to figure out what you were eating that was causing your issues or chronic conditions.

Generally, if you are metabolically healthy, you can tolerate some selective fruit and vegetables. If you are not metabolically healthy, then you should continue to abstain from them. 

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[mention=2]Bob[/mention]
In that case, are there specific fruits that are generally better?
and why I see more people on this diet eating fruits but not vegetables, what is the difference?

It is believed that plants do not want to be eaten because then they cannot propagate and that’s why they have evolved to have so many toxins in them and why they can case inflammation in the human body. That’s also why they taste terrible imo.
Fruits are meant to be eaten because that is how they propagate. They are colorful and sweet to attract animals to eat them so their seeds can be spread around.
What many don’t understand is that early man did not have the fruit that we have today. Their fruit was small and not very sweet and only available seasonally. Or fruit today has been genetically modified to be larger and sweeter. Pest resistant and grown year round.
It is advised that if you want to eat carnivore as our ancestors did then you should eat it sparingly and seasonally.
I like fruit and I do miss it but I won’t touch it anymore because I don’t need that sweet trigger and it does nothing nutritionally for me. I can also do without the insulin spike.


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19 hours ago, Matan1262 said:

In that case, are there specific fruits that are generally better?

If you were not metabolically healthy or had diabetes then you would want to focus on low-glycemic fruits. But since you are 24 years old, my height (5'8") and 135 pounds (62.5kg) I have a feeling you are pretty healthy. If you are trying to reverse any chronic illness, then you would want to do standard carnivore or lion diet for a while and then slowly reintroduce one fruit at a time.

Odds are, the fruit will do you no harm. Dr. Paul Saladino who used to advocate a carnivore diet now advocates an animal-based diet with fruit, honey, and raw milk. He is metabolically healthy though. Many of the other carnivore doctors think he's gone off the deep end since he now advocates 300g of carbs per day. I personally disagree with those numbers, especially if you are not metabolically healthy. Even if you are, I think that number should be 100g or less. I very much believe that we are designed to be a low carbohydrate meat-based mammal.

16 hours ago, Geezy said:

Their fruit was small and not very sweet and only available seasonally.

This statement by Geoff is worthy of some deep meditation, imo. I believe man has ate fruit from the beginning, but most fruit is only available during the harvest season. It would ripen around August, people would eat it and it would fatten them up for the winter ahead. Once it was gone, it was gone, and you wouldn't have had fruit again till the next year. But today, due to technology and trade, it's "harvest season" 365 days a year down at the supermarket.

16 hours ago, Geezy said:

fruit today has been genetically modified to be larger and sweeter.

And this is true too. I have a few apple trees in my backyard, and I pick and eat from them in August. But these apples are little bite size snacks compared to the big luscious apples you see at the market.

20 hours ago, Matan1262 said:

I see more people on this diet eating fruits but not vegetables, what is the difference?

Plants produce toxins and self-defense chemicals to discourage being eaten. They want to live. These chemicals are found in their leaves, stems, and roots, and especialy their seed are well-protected. However, they WANT their fruit to be eaten, because this is how they propagate. So there will be much lower amounts, if any, of these self-defense chemicals in the fruits. 

It these self-defense chemicals that could be causing your inflammation, chronic, or auto-immune conditions.

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1 hour ago, Matan1262 said:

@Bob @Geezy

Amazing answers guys thanks.

 

@Bob can you be more specific about fruits, give me some to start with.

I really want to re introduce avocado for instance 

Avocado probably the best fruit to add first. Good fats. 

 

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[mention=2]Bob[/mention] [mention=79]Geezy[/mention]
Amazing answers guys thanks.
 
[mention=2]Bob[/mention] can you be more specific about fruits, give me some to start with.
I really want to re introduce avocado for instance 

Start with berries.


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22 hours ago, Matan1262 said:

@Bob can you be more specific about fruits, give me some to start with.

Sure. @Geezy was correct when he said to start with berries. "Berries are best" on a low carb diet. 

  1. Raspberries – Half a cup (60 grams) contains 3 grams of carbs.
  2. Blackberries – Half a cup (70 grams) contains 4 grams of carbs.
  3. Strawberries – Eight medium-sized (100 grams) contains 6 grams of carbs.
  4. Plum – One medium-sized (65 grams) contains 7 grams of carbs.
  5. Clementine – One medium-sized (75 grams) contains 8 grams of carbs.
  6. Kiwi – One medium-sized (70 grams) contains 8 grams of carbs.
  7. Cherries – Half a cup (75 grams or about 12 cherries) contains 8 grams of carbs.
  8. Blueberries – Half a cup (75 grams) contains 9 grams of carbs.
  9. Cantaloupe (melon) – One cup (160 grams) contains 11 grams of carbs.
  10. Peach – One medium-sized (150 grams) contains 13 grams of carbs.

Things like apples, oranges, and bananas are over 20g and very "sugary".

If you are going to be liberally low carb (less than 100g a day) then keep your fruit servings to probably 3 or less. If you still want to be ketogenic, then you are probably looking at only 1 or 2 servings a day. And personally, I would have them in the morning, so you have all day to burn it off, lol.

22 hours ago, Matan1262 said:

I really want to re introduce avocado for instance 

And @Orweller was right on the money here. Avocado is great. It's technically a fruit although most people think of it as a vegetable. It only has 2g carbs per 100g sized avocado and is chock full of healthy fats.

If you choose to move from standard carnivore over to a meat-based keto or an animal-based diet do let us know how it goes for you. Us pure meat-eaters will still love you, lol 😄

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7 minutes ago, Bob said:

Sure. @Geezy was correct when he said to start with berries. "Berries are best" on a low carb diet. 

  1. Raspberries – Half a cup (60 grams) contains 3 grams of carbs.
  2. Blackberries – Half a cup (70 grams) contains 4 grams of carbs.
  3. Strawberries – Eight medium-sized (100 grams) contains 6 grams of carbs.
  4. Plum – One medium-sized (65 grams) contains 7 grams of carbs.
  5. Clementine – One medium-sized (75 grams) contains 8 grams of carbs.
  6. Kiwi – One medium-sized (70 grams) contains 8 grams of carbs.
  7. Cherries – Half a cup (75 grams or about 12 cherries) contains 8 grams of carbs.
  8. Blueberries – Half a cup (75 grams) contains 9 grams of carbs.
  9. Cantaloupe (melon) – One cup (160 grams) contains 11 grams of carbs.
  10. Peach – One medium-sized (150 grams) contains 13 grams of carbs.

Things like apples, oranges, and bananas are over 20g and very "sugary".

If you are going to be liberally low carb (less than 100g a day) then keep your fruit servings to probably 3 or less. If you still want to be ketogenic, then you are probably looking at only 1 or 2 servings a day. And personally, I would have them in the morning, so you have all day to burn it off, lol.

And @Orweller was right on the money here. Avocado is great. It's technically a fruit although most people think of it as a vegetable. It only has 2g carbs per 100g sized avocado and is chock full of healthy fats.

If you choose to move from standard carnivore over to a meat-based keto or an animal-based diet do let us know how it goes for you. Us pure meat-eaters will still love you, lol 😄

@Bob

I tried a bit of avocado today.

Ioved avocado before starting.

Now it was weird, I really enjoyed the beef but not the avocado, it was ok but a bit weird taste, I yhought I would love it

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[mention=2]Bob[/mention]
I tried a bit of avocado today.
Ioved avocado before starting.
Now it was weird, I really enjoyed the beef but not the avocado, it was ok but a bit weird taste, I yhought I would love it

Even before I’m became a carnivore I thought avocados were nasty.


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7 hours ago, Matan1262 said:

I tried a bit of avocado today.

 

If you're doing avocado, you could always make a snazzy dip with the spices of your choice. It could be mayo based, yogurt based, sour cream based, or you could use a little of each. Whip it up real good and dip pork rinds in it (or other stuff).

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I've noticed raw milk mentioned and had thought all milk was out because of the lactose (milk sugar). I have an excellent source of raw milk down here but have ceased my milk drinking for the diet. When we get a gallon and it sits in the fridge for a while, you can see the cream sitting on top of the milk. About 1/3 of the gallon is cream! My wife used to make clabber milk from raw milk. 

I think I'm in ketosis now and I wouldn't want to jeopardize that by consuming sugar at this point.

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46 minutes ago, Steven2023 said:

[I] had thought all milk was out because of the lactose... I think I'm in ketosis now and I wouldn't want to jeopardize that by consuming sugar at this point.

Yes, I don't drink milk either and this is part of the reason (the other part being I just never really have made a habit of drinking it).

You could still pull off milk on a meat-based keto diet if you watch your total carbs. It's no different than the fruit situation. Then if you are just on an animal-based "carnivore" diet you might drink all kinds of milk and just not care. 

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I don’t drink milk either but I still eat dairy. Cheese,cream and yogurt. I’ve started making my own yogurt using cream but I do want to try making some from raw milk. I know of a dairy near me that sells it. I also hope to find raw milk cheese.


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